The Official PS4 thread!

[Aslanna]

Sparrow Racing League!

[Winnow]

Sparrow Racing League!

And I thought they were going to announce reduced load times and the elimination of the useless space ship screen!

Prepare for best Sparrow being a Gatorade Green Special that you need to buy a case of Gatorade to get a code for! If you don't get the code, there will be a warning for epilepsy players about a screen strobing quest notice permanently on display during races.

[Aslanna]

Are you an epilepsy expert? Seems like you may have suffered a seizure while composing that post!

[Aslanna]

So I basically spent all day Sat and half the day today today (gotta go back to OH!) watching the PSX livestream. Some panels/interviews have been more interesting than others but overall I thought it was some decent content.

Any bets on how soon it is before MS comes up with their own XBX? Surprised they haven't done that by now! They need something to spur those XBO sales.

[Winnow]

Uncharted 4 gets delayed until April 2016

Delays again wow
same old bullshit crap planning
suck it suck it suck

haiku worthy hilarity

[Aslanna]

Predictable troll is predictable.

[Winnow]

It's a rough Monday for Sony, as the PlayStation Network appears to be experiencing widespread issues. Sony acknowledge that it's aware of the problems, which have affected PS4, PS3 and Vita users for pretty much the entire morning. The company's network status tracker also notes that all of PSN's services are having issues. There's no word when service will be restored, but we'd imagine Sony is working feverishly to get things sorted ahead of its CES press conference tomorrow. We've reached out to Sony for additional comment and will update if we hear back.

Business as usual!

I saw in the comments of one of these many Sony Online down news posts that the reason Sony is hacked more than Microsoft is that hackers were upset when Sony sued users for putting back features on the PS3 that were there to begin with. They've been hacking them ever since. Well deserved IMO. PS3 was a joke. Sony has no clue how to deal with it's users. Root kits are the worst of it but there's more than that. Shady company.

True hero:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rba7qjb0378

Don't mess with the dude that has the keys to your safe! Legendary hacks of both iOS and PS3.

[Funkmasterr]

Sometimes when I read your posts, I find myself hoping you get aids and die of a cold. True story.

[Winnow]

Sometimes when I read your posts, I find myself hoping you get aids and die of a cold. True story.

you sound edgy and cool

[Funkmasterr]

Sometimes when I read your posts, I find myself hoping you get aids and die of a cold. True story.

you sound edgy and cool

Cool story, bro.

[Boogahz]

Sometimes when I read your posts, I find myself hoping you get aids and die of a cold. True story.

you sound edgy and cool

You're still the biggest waste of bandwidth to ever access VV, and we've had some "good" ones

[Winnow]

Sometimes when I read your posts, I find myself hoping you get aids and die of a cold. True story.

you sound edgy and cool

You're still the biggest waste of bandwidth to ever access VV, and we've had some "good" ones

At least we can count on your soccer posts that no one cares about!

[Aslanna]

It's called football.

One handy thing about the PS4. As I returned that laptop I bought I decided to bring my PS4 with me to OH. It easily fits in the laptop bag I had. Good luck doing that with some other consoles!

As far as all Winnow's other trolling goes I'm not going to bother. The harder he tries the easier it is to ignore. However if you add up the downtime last year between PSN and XBL I'm sure you'd find that XBL had more outages. It must be hard keeping all those 300,000+ hamsters alive.

[Aslanna]

Sony sold more than 5.7 million units of the PlayStation 4 during the 2015 holiday season, bringing lifetime sales of the console to 35.9 million, the company announced today.

5.7 million sales in basically a month. Unstoppable!

[Aslanna]

The NPD Group has released its monthly report for December tracking new, physical sales in the US. Coinciding with that, Sony has released a statement claiming that the PS4 was the best-selling console in the US during both December and the entirety of 2015.

Entirety of 2015! Not sure that's a shock to anyone as I think XBO barely squeaked by the PS4 in October other than that's it's been all PS4 all the time.

[Winnow]

The Playstation has one major drawback where Xbox crushes it

Sony's PlayStation 4 is a great game console.

Let's be clear about that right up front: the PlayStation 4 is an excellent game console, and tens of millions of people spending $400 or more apiece to get their own attests to that.

What's not so excellent about the PlayStation 4 is its gamepad, the DualShock 4. In terms of how it's used in games, it's great – the feel of the controller is spot-on. What's not so great is the technical stuff: the battery is atrocious, and the build quality is similarly lackluster. In those respects, the Xbox One controller has Sony's completely beaten.

Great stuff about horrible build quality and joke of a battery life in that article.

The importance of the controller to the console is like the importance of speakers to a sound system and Sony failed hard with the PS4.

What good is being served a nice bowl of soup that's a couple degrees hotter than the competitions if they give you a spoon with holes in it to eat it with? Lame!

[Aslanna]

Yeah cry more about it. Just like Sony is crying about those 36 million PS4s they've sold. Oh and also like Microsoft is crying for only having sold half that many XBOs. Oh and also for having lost the last generation as well to the PS3. Despite launching for cheaper and a YEAR earlier.

Keep fucking that chicken.

[Winnow]

Sony's PlayStation Network is suffering a major outage, according to multiple online reports.

Thousands of gamers have taken to Twitter and other social networks to report issues accessing core features, such as playing games online and buying items from the PlayStation Store.

Sony's PlayStation support website has posted a message saying: "NOTICE: PSN is under maintenance".

The company has also acknowledged the issue on its Twitter support page:

"We're aware that some PSN users are experiencing connectivity issues. Thank you for your patience as we investigate.

— Ask PlayStation (@AskPlayStation) February 1, 2016"

Meanwhile, games giant Bungie acknowledged that some of its customers were having problems accessing online services in a tweet:

"We are aware of issues preventing some PlayStation 4 users from playing Destiny. Thank you for your patience as we investigate.

— Bungie Help (@BungieHelp) February 1, 2016"

According to website DownDetector, which tracks major network outages, problems started at around 4pm this afternoon.

This latest outage comes just a few weeks after huge issues caused the PSN Network to be offline for hours over Christmas weekend.

Are you experiencing issues with PSN?

So many of these lately.

[Boogahz]

You would hear about more xbone outages if people actually used them

[Aslanna]

Recent comments by a top Electronic Arts executive seem to have given the clearest picture to date of the Xbox One installation base.

In remarks to investors during a quarterly earnings call (reported by Ars Technica), Blake Jorgensen, the EA chief financial officer, said his firm estimated 55 million PlayStation 4 and Xbox One units, combined, in the marketplace as of present day. Jorgenson couched that figure as "almost 50 percent higher than previous console cycle," calling it "very, very positive news."

Microsoft has been coy about its console sales figures to date, focusing on less distinctive categories like Xbox Live subscribers and numbers of players overall. Sony, in November, claimed sales of 30.2 million PS4s worldwide, a figure that expanded to 35.9 million units (as reported by Sony) on Jan. 3.

If Jorgensen's number is any guide, then 55 million, minus the PS4's 35.9 million claimed, leaves 19.1 million Xbox Ones sold since the console's November 2013 launch. That's just short of a 2-to-1 advantage for the PlayStation 4.

Nearly two to one! No surprise that people are choosing the superior product. They've shamed Microsoft so much Microsoft isn't even reporting numbers any longer.

Domination by every generation of PlayStation consoles from PS1 all the way to PS4! Not even sure why MS is bothering. I guess they like coming in second all the time.

[Aslanna]

PlayStation 4 sales leap past 40 million
That puts Sony's PS4 at roughly double the number of Xbox One consoles that Microsoft has sold.

Sony's PlayStation 4 has numbers on its side.

On Thursday, Sony revealed that it has now sold more than 40 million PS4 units since the console debuted in November 2013. It got a big push during last year's holiday shopping season: Consumers scarfed up 5.7 million PS4 devices during the fourth quarter, pushing the overall total sold by the start of 2016 to around 36 million.

That's significantly ahead of its chief rival, Microsoft's Xbox One. In January, Electronic Arts CFO Blake Jorgensen said that 55 million combined PS4 and Xbox One consoles were sold worldwide before the end of 2015. Subtract the PS4's 36 million and you're left with roughly 19 million for the Xbox One, which also debuted in November 2013.

Whoooo 40 million!

[Aslanna]

NPD for May. Almost a sweep for PS4! It figures the Call of Duty nerds are still solidly entrenched up Microsoft's butt.

The order of the platforms in parenthesis indicates which version sold the best.

Uncharted 4: A Thief’s End (PS4)
Doom (PS4, Xbox One, PC)
Overwatch (PS4, Xbox One, PC)
Battleborn (PS4, Xbox One, PC)
Grand Theft Auto V (PS4, Xbox One, 360, PS3, PC)
Minecraft (PS4, Xbox One, 360, PS3)
NBA 2K16 (PS4, Xbox One, 360, PS3)
Call of Duty: Black Ops III (Xbox One, PS4, 360, PS3, PC)
MLB 16: The Show (PS4, PS3)
Dark Souls III (PS4, Xbox One)

Of course this shows the growing irrelevance of NPD as they don't count digital sales. I'm sure Overwatch probably outsold Uncharted 4. Then again it was released late in the month but still... Still a solid showing for Uncharted 4. A single platform release beating games releasing on 3 platforms!

I am amazed GTAV is still in the top 5. And Minecraft... How does everyone not own that already?

In hardware news, PS4 also outsold the XBO (again!) despite Microsoft "temporarily" lowering the price to $299.

[Winnow]

All the way back in 2010, a class-action lawsuit was filed against Sony after the ability to run Linux on the PS3 was removed. Last week, after six years of haggling, the company agreed to pay up.

As Ars Technica report, the decision was made last Friday, and—provided the judge agrees to Sony’s terms—will see anyone who used Linux on their PS3 able to claim $55. Those who went out and bought a PS3 because the ability to run Linux on it had been advertised can claim an additional $9.

Specifically, those eligible need to be have purchased a “Fat” (launch) PS3 model “in the United States between November 1, 2006, and April 1, 2010", and be able to “attest under oath to their purchase of the product and installation of Linux, provide proof of their purchase or serial number and PlayStation Network Sign-in ID, and submit some proof of their use of the Other OS functionality.”

Those are a lot of hoops to jump through for such an old purchase, so while Sony’s payouts have a technical ceiling of around 10 million people (the number of Fat PS3s sold in the US in that time), the real winners here are probably the lawyers who brought the suit, who were awarded “up to $2.25 million in attorneys’ fees”.

I still have my "Fat" PS3 in a junk pile somewhere. Sony is great with their legal team making it extremely hard to get paid. "submit some proof of their use of the Other OS functionality" what? Sony took away more features than they gave with the PS3. Fancy orchestra must have been playing Empire Strikes back theme during that decision.

[Aslanna]

There is a PS3 thread you know. It's even stickied for your enjoyment.

[Winnow]

This can't be tucked away neatly in some forgotten thread.

First they came for the imagine engine, but I didn't care because I didn't play PS2 games on my PS3

Then they came for my linux, but I didn't care because I didn't use linux

And then they delayed my favorite game, but by then I couldn't focus to protest because the orchestra had blown out my ear drums.

Never forget!

[Winnow]

Things Are Starting To Look A Bit Grim For Sony's PlayStation VR


By Paul Tassi, http://www.forbes.com
June 27th, 2016


Sony’s PlayStation VR headset is going to be one of the ultimate tests for virtual reality, perhaps even the most significant moment in the short lifespan of the platform to date. While the Oculus Rift and HTC Vive have indeed launched, this fall, Sony’s headset will allow anyone with a PlayStation 4, 35-40 million people, use VR without the aid of an expensive PC. The headset itself is hundreds cheaper than its competition (at $400) and it looks to be the first somewhat affordable, accessible mainstream VR set on the market that isn’t phone-based.

But what if people hate it?

The headset is regarded as one of the most comfortable to wear on the market, but lately, it seems like the praises mostly seem to end there. The problems with PSVR seem to fall into a few different categories, and things seem like they started going awry around E3.

One of the most perplexing stories of the show was the revelation that Resident Evil 7 in VR caused simulation sickness in a wide variety of players, even VR veterans. Most pinpoint the problem to the RE7 control scheme which lets you pivot the camera without actually moving your head, which is a very, very disorienting experience in VR. Others said the issue also stems from the fact that Sony only requires developers to hit 60 fps as a minimum benchmark, where other VR headsets demand 90 fps for a smoother experience.

The other problem with PSVR is best chronicled in a lengthy VentureBeat piece discussing the somewhat unforeseen weakness of the headset, Sony’s reliance on six year-old Move controller technology, those magic glowing wands that were originally created to compete with the Wiimote, but were effectively mothballed until now, where they’ve been resurrected for VR.

It’s not just that they add extra cost (the Move controllers plus a PS camera will run about $100), it’s that they’re just plain inferior to the HTC and Oculus touch controllers. As the piece explains, the controllers are not comfortable to hold for long periods of time, nor do they have the kind of 1:1 tracking that many have come to expect from VR hand-controls. It’s a lot more Wii-like waggling than precise control, which never worked out well for the Wiimote and Move originally, and certainly is unwelcome in VR where precision is more important than ever.

It would be a big problem if PSVR fails to deliver, not just for Sony, but VR in general. This will be many people’s first real experience with consumer VR, given that only a small number can afford elaborate Oculus and Vive set-ups. But everyone has a PS4, and for that reason alone, we will see many first-timers checking out VR that way.

But if it’s bad? The consequences of that could be huge. If your first impression of VR is something with a sub-par framerate, possible motion sickness and poor controls, you may end up turned off to the idea for a good long while. It also doesn’t help that many of PSVR’s games feel more like Wii-waggling/Kinect minigames than full titles, including the much-vaunted Final Fantasy and Batman games teased at E3, which are more “experiences” than actual games. If VR turns into something that feels like yet another gimmick like motion controls or Kinect, that’s going to leave a bad taste in gamers’ mouths indefinitely.

I’ve already written about how the Oculus Rift itself has failed to hook me, or completely sell me on the concept of VR in its current form. The VR headset I dreamed I always wanted usually spends most of the week sitting in its box in my closet as I continue to play games on console and PC. I’m worried that PSVR might result in the same experience for those who buy it, set aside the way the Wii and Kinect were after a few days/weeks of “oh wow cool” gameplay. Or, it might be even worse, and make an outright bad first impression if players find themselves physically ill depending on the game they’re playing.

PlayStation VR doesn’t come out until October 13th, meaning Sony has time to make some final tweaks, but probably no major overhauls at this point. The Move controllers are something that will have to be replaced down the road, but it’s too late for that now. At minimum, Sony needs to make sure that games like Resident Evil 7 do not induce nausea for players, even if that means not allowing the game to be released on the platform until that issue is fixed. They also need to set expectations for games like Arkham VR, so players understand they’re not about to start playing Arkham Knight in first person, and that it’s a much, much more scaled back experience.

Even as VR keeps running into initial stumbling blocks, I do believe in the long term future of the platform. It is going to change the world someday, but each misstep will push that dream further and further back. Too much is being invested in VR for it to completely fail at this point. The tech is there, and it will only get better in time. But it needs to do everything it possibly can to make a good first impression, lest the general public be scared off from the idea for years to come.

Posting this here instead of VR thread because PS4 owners should get fair warning. VR is awesome sauce but Sony jumped the gun with an under performing offering.

-resolution sub par
-fps 60 fps instead of 90 fps for Vive and Rift (will make you sick)
-gay snow cone orbs with poor tracking, wii ancient tech competitor not fit for VR and no where near Vive or Touch controllers.

This isn't Wii vs Xbox comparison where some people will would still enjoy crap resolution games. That doesn't work with VR. I get VR sickness zero percent of the time with my Vive with Vive games while I'm prone to getting motion sick from time to time on FPS game, at least with the old ones like Duke Nukem 3D.. I felt sick after 5 minutes of an Oculus game I played with a standard controller.

The PS4 Neo won't help much as it won't increase to low res in the PSVR headset and will do nothing to improve the ancient motion tracking they use.

Meanwhile, Microsoft will have a console powerful enough to handle the current Rift and can use Oculus Touch controllers if you want. It looks like to me Sony is going to be stuck with the substantially lower powered half gen console and weak VR for a couple years. I'm sure will be fine for normal gaming but will hurt VR with bunch of VR sick people turned off.

VR is no gimmick. Sony knows this and that's why they rushed things. Bad move for them and all of VR.

[Aslanna]

I'm also somewhat of a neat freak, so the lack of folders really bugs me.

Good news! Firmware 4.0 will have folders. And stuff.


Oh and that article Winnow posted "Things Are Starting To Look A Bit Grim For Sony's PlayStation VR" is just dumb. Shit isn't even released yet how can things look grim? Poor trolling which is why I didn't even bother to respond 2 months ago.

Will it be as good as Rift or Vive? Anyone who thinks so is stupid. But will it be so horrible as to turn everyone off to VR? Doubtful.

those magic glowing wands that were originally created to compete with the Wiimote, but were effectively mothballed until now, where they’ve been resurrected for VR.

Another ignorant statement in this poorly written (and researched) article. Sony didn't resurrect anything... Morpheus prototypes from YEARS ago were shown with Move controllers. Nothing was "mothballed" or "resurrected".

Not to mention "magic glowing wands" were around before the Wiimote even came out:

PlayStation Move stems from early work on the EyeToy, a webcam-based controller for the PlayStation 2 conceived in 1999 and released in 2003. Early in the EyeToy's inception, developers experimented with color-based 3D wand tracking, including prototypes using spheres.

[Funkmasterr]

I saw that. I am really getting sick of waiting for them to implement some way to change your name, though; I really don't like my PSN name anymore. I've heard mention that there isn't an underlying ID for your profile and that your name is actually all there is to tie everything together in your profile, but it seems like just adding the option to have an alternate "display name" or something like that would be relatively straight forward.

It's definitely cool they are adding folders though, I'll enjoy tidying things up a bit.

[Aslanna]

It's definitely cool they are adding folders though, I'll enjoy tidying things up a bit.

I installed the beta but haven't messed with it yet. I can see why folders are nice but never an option I missed even though I used them on the PS3. No reason that shouldn't have been on the PS4 day one though.

[Funkmasterr]

It's definitely cool they are adding folders though, I'll enjoy tidying things up a bit.

I installed the beta but haven't messed with it yet. I can see why folders are nice but never an option I missed even though I used them on the PS3. No reason that shouldn't have been on the PS4 day one though.

For sure. I liked to keep games organized by genre - I know you can go all the way to the right and go to all your games, but I don't like that as much as I've got quite a few of them.

[Aslanna]

PS4 "Slim" pictures apparently leaked. I have to say it doesn't look that good compared to the the original PS4. I still don't think it needed to be slimmed as the original was fine.

If you want the original model make sure to pick one up as this will more than likely just replace that one.

[Winnow]

Yeah, I don't see a reason for a slim model for the PS4 if it's the same power as the current one with no additional features.

[Aslanna]

PS+ going to $60 22-Sep or so. Stock up now!

[Winnow]

Wow, apparently the annoying blue light on the front of the controller wasn't enough. Now a seizure warning is probably needed for the new flashing blue light on top of the controller.

http://kotaku.com/slim-ps4-apparently-u ... 1785630809

RAVESTICK!

[Winnow]

Only good thing I've heard so far about new slim PS4 is that the new PS4 controllers have longer battery life.

[Winnow]

PS4 Pro is kind of ugly and I thought the PS4 looked good. Internet response seems as expected.

http://kotaku.com/the-internet-reacts-t ... 1786346111

Some pretty funny reactions linked above.

No ultra HD blu-ray in the PS4 Pro, but the Xbox One S does. Blu-ray is Sony's thing, @PlayStation. This makes 0 sense.

This was a really confusing announcement. No one on stage seemed excited, and nothing was really explained. Also, lack of 4kbluray is... puzzling.

Looks like they better bring back the orchestra!

[Tyek]

I got to watch it and I have to agree with Winnow this time, it was a pretty bad announcement. Very awkward crowd reaction, does not look like they did anything but add HDR and 4k video and upscaling on graphics. I usually ignore Winnows trolling, but he is right on this one. Very disappointing announcements.

[Aslanna]

I didn't watch it because honestly I forgot about it. It does seem universal opinion about it is that it wasn't a very good announcement so that's not something I can argue. Or actually give a shit about.

As to the actual product itself the lack of 4k Blu-Ray I think is a mistake. Sony has always placed the newest optical format in their consoles and that drove a ton of PS2 (DVD) and PS3 (Blu-Ray) sales with people using them as their main media component. My guess is that Sony is betting on more and more things going digital so they'd rather not spend the money on a more pricey component they don't think a lot of people will use. That's a bold move. Will it pay off? Time will tell. I'd think Winnow would be all supportive of that as he's always going on and on about the death of physical media. That's just showing his fanboism though which is to be expected at this point.

For me personally I own zero Blu Rays and no 4K HDR TV, and no immediate plans to purchase either of those things, so it's not something that bothers me in the slightest. I can see how some will now choose a different device, whether it be standalone player or XBO, instead of a PS4 though.

I have no issue with the design.

[Winnow]

The thing about lack of Blu-Ray drive is really odd considering the huge HDDVD vs Blu-Ray battle that took place with the PS3/360. Blu-Ray was partially developed (or fully can't remember) by Sony. Microsoft put a 4K Blu-Ray drive in their "standard" console which makes the "Pro" PS4 lack of it really stand out and make no sense.

People also have an issue with the "pro" name of the new console. It does seem like a bad naming scheme for your core people that own a "regular" PS4. PS4K seemed like a perfect name for it although maybe they didnt do that due to lack of the Blu-Ray 4K drive.

Not sure what's going on with Sony's design team but it got worse, not better. Adding another layer to the look of the PS4 looks dumb. Did they also confirm that the controller will have yet another light on top of the controller to annoy to combine with the gloing light on the front?

Apple's new iPhone 7 failed to impress so I guess there's that. Maybe was a bad day to present or something.

[Funkmasterr]

Maybe it wasn't a display of marketing genius, but it's a good incremental upgrade for people who'd like to have a bit better graphics/framerate. The thing is, the PS4 is still curb stomping the Xbox, and now their mid generation stop-gap is going to be a year ahead of Microsoft's; I know Microsoft has stated that they think this is an advantage for them, but I'd argue it's just going to further Sony's lead. They'll have a year to sell ahead of MS, but more importantly this positions them to potentially put out the PS5 a year ahead of them as well.

4K Blu Ray would have been a waste - it would have forced them to sell it at a higher price point, and many people have moved over entirely to streaming video and downloading their games. I agree it's not the best looking console, but I don't care about that either and quite honestly, neither should anyone else.

[Winnow]

Funny how when I preached physical media was a waste people defended it, now all the sudden it doesn't matter. Microsoft had the vision, the masses, including most on this forum did not. Gotta have my cool box!

The thing about the "upgrade" is it's not really enough to upgrade to while the "standard" replacement for the Xbox One is a nice upgrade for no extra cost. Next year's Scorpio console will be a much larger increase in power worthy of an upgrade.

PSVR, will still be underpowered and lower specs than Vive/Oculus which will most likely (one of the two) be compatible with the new Xbox Scorpio system.

Not really intending to bash Sony in this case but I don't see their strategy as being sound. Perhaps the leader in consoles for each generation is doomed to become complacent and let the competitor catch up the following generation each time.

[Funkmasterr]

Funny how when I preached physical media was a waste people defended it, now all the sudden it doesn't matter. Microsoft had the vision, the masses, including most on this forum did not. Gotta have my cool box!

The thing about the "upgrade" is it's not really enough to upgrade to while the "standard" replacement for the Xbox One is a nice upgrade for no extra cost. Next year's Scorpio console will be a much larger increase in power worthy of an upgrade.

PSVR, will still be underpowered and lower specs than Vive/Oculus which will most likely (one of the two) be compatible with the new Xbox Scorpio system.

Not really intending to bash Sony in this case but I don't see their strategy as being sound. Perhaps the leader in consoles for each generation is doomed to become complacent and let the competitor catch up the following generation each time.

Except it's not just a marginal increase in GPU power, it's huge. I've also seen articles from people who say they genuinely like PS VR more than Oculus, so I think this is a bit more subjective than you've been presenting it (surprise, surprise). The thing is, Scorpio is still going to be a year behind, Xbox is still going to be severely lacking in exclusives compared to the PS, and with MS introducing the ability to play all Xbox games on the PC - the reason to buy an expensive higher end console is going to not really be there.

[Aslanna]

Funny how when I preached physical media was a waste people defended it, now all the sudden it doesn't matter. Microsoft had the vision, the masses, including most on this forum did not. Gotta have my cool box!

I said it doesn't matter to ME. In regards to movies. I don't buy movies so that's why lack of a 4K BR drive doesn't matter to me. I still prefer my games on disc, which the PS4P still supports, and I don't see that changing so I'm not quite sure of your point there. I was simply speculating that MAYBE that was why Sony didn't feel the need to add a 4k BR drive in their new consoles since they expect the majority of people to just stream 4k. I also stated I think it's a mistake and part of that is due to internet infrastructure in a lot of places. Not everyone has a gigabit line with no data caps.

PSVR, will still be underpowered and lower specs than Vive/Oculus

And lower cost of entry. Sales of Vive and Oculus are pretty flat now that all the early adopters got their product. I do see MS pairing with probably the Oculus though because they don't come up with their own shit they just buy it from someone else.

Not really intending to bash Sony in this case but I don't see their strategy as being sound. Perhaps the leader in consoles for each generation is doomed to become complacent and let the competitor catch up the following generation each time.

The thing is that the term "console generation" is now a thing of the past just like with phones. Pick your ecosystem and just buy the latest model whenever you get around to upgrading. Sure Scorpio will be faster than the PS4P when it releases in OVER A YEAR FROM NOW. But in the meantime Sony will have already released their more powerful console and will already working on the next version which will come out two years after Scorpio thus placing them 'ahead' once again so I'm not sure how the competition in this case catches up as you state. They are still behind, other than in regards to 4K BR, and will be behind for another year. How is that Sony becoming complacent?

With them standardizing on x86 architecture they really don't have to do a lot more than just stick in a faster CPU and GPU into each box and call it new. I'd expect existing software to continue working with new hardware just like it does with phones so backward compatibility is also a thing of the past since it's just a function of the OS. If they are smart that's how they will do it but hey I'm no engineer or marketer!

Hopefully this ends stupid "console wars" which, while entertaining for a bit, are now something I don't even think about. Enjoy the console you have why do you care about what someone else is doing?

[Winnow]

I've also seen articles from people who say they genuinely like PS VR more than Oculus, so I think this is a bit more subjective than you've been presenting it (surprise, surprise).

I think most would agree I've had the most experience with VR on the forum with owning and using the Oculus DK2 and Vive extensively.

Couple things. PSVR will still most likely blow your mind. The original Oculus DK2 was amazing to me a few years ago. It also looks like Sony will have quite a few games for it when its released.

That said, room scale and motion control are huge factors when it comes to immersion. I would never go back to anything that's not room scale. While Sony's snow cones technically can act as motion controllers, they aren't very well designed and if you take the time to read up on experiences, the tracking hasn't been as smooth as Vive's solution. Jittery hands caused by intermittent loss of tracking is a big time immersion breaker. The actual design of the Snow Cones are nowhere near as ergonomic for VR as Vives controllers or Oculus touch controllers.

PSVR is something that will be placed in the closet along with your old Wii after a few sessions. The resolution simply isn't good enough. Vive/Oculus's higher res isn't even good enough but at least it's borderline OK for viewing movies and reading text in games, etc.

VR AND AR are here to stay and I'd bet Sony's next generation of it will be great in a few years. Sony will probably develop some nice dedicted VR controllers, it's ok to have the thumb joysticks in the same place with separate VR controllers! Sony also has the best designed VR headset (of this first generation) for looks/ease of use, they just need more powerful internal components.

Anyway, I haven't used my consoles in a long time and won't save for the rare exclusive (FFX I think is console only) Scorpio seems to be moving closer to PC type updates/specs so that is a good thing, especially with Microsoft games being one fee for both console/PC.

[Tyek]

I never really paid attention to the light before but then I found out a number of games utilize that function. In some games the light turns red, or yellow to denote health or if something is close. By adding that little light it will make that feature more prominent so I have no issue with that part of the design.

[Winnow]

From Forbes.com:

It's Now Clear Why Sony Didn't Debut PS4 Pro At E3

By Paul Tassi, http://www.forbes.com
September 9th, 2016

One of the great mysteries of E3 this year was Sony’s refusal to show off the console everyone knew existed, PS4 Neo, during the biggest games show of the year. Ahead of their press event, Sony downplayed the new system, saying it wouldn’t be shown until later. During the event, Sony put on a great show, but ended on a very clear anti-climax, showing off footage from Days Gone, a new zombie game that had already debuted earlier in the night, as their big finale. It seemed like a clear-cut case of the Neo being ripped out of that final slot, and shelved for another day.

After this week’s PlayStation Meeting, which revealed that the PS4 Neo is actually the PS4 Pro, many wondered why this reveal needed its own event at all, given that not all that much was shown. It seemed like something that could have been slotted into E3 easily, so what gives?

Reflecting on this further, it seems pretty obvious to me why Sony made this call.

The first answer, the one people were giving at E3 itself, is probably still true to some degree: Sony didn’t want to be outshone by Microsoft. When Sony learned that Microsoft was planning to show off the Scorpio, they did not want to debut their less powerful system up against the better specs of Scorpio, officially losing the power edge they’d enjoyed over Xbox One for so long, and that’s all anyone would have been talking about after the show. Whether they went first or second, debuting the PS4 Pro and having the Scorpio already one-up it instantly would not have been the narrative they wanted coming out of E3. So in order to avoid losing that game, they just didn’t play.

But the thought there was that Sony was now perhaps going back to the drawing board a bit, and instead of releasing the Neo/Pro this holiday, maybe they’d put it back in the oven, make it more powerful, and put it up against Scorpio directly in holiday 2017.

We now know that wasn’t the case, and the PS4 Pro actually is coming out this year, just two months from now, in some ways making its absence from E3 even weirder. Though after this week’s show, we know how it would have played out if Sony devoted a large portion of their event to the PS4 Pro, much less as its grand finale. Not well.

The same problems present with this week’s presentation, the inability to effectively display 4K/HDR content on large screens and/or through livestreams, would have still been present.

Past that, the problem would have been amplified, because the show would have been a mix of showing “regular” PS4 games and “super” PS4 Pro games. Chances are, over these livestreams, most potential players/buyers would not have been able to tell much of a difference.

I imagine a really weird scenario playing out where half the games of the show would have been shown on normal PS4 (because they don’t have Pro versions yet) and then half were shown with the Pro’s 4K capabilities. While in person, these side-by-side comparisons might be compelling, that almost certainly would have not been the case over a livestream, and it would have made the already awkward debut of the Pro, which we saw this week, even worse. That narrative would have crippled Sony coming out of E3, and though they’re dealing with that awkwardness now, all anyone had to say after Sony’s E3 presser this year were good things, for the most part.

Microsoft was smart because they debuted the Scorpio mostly by talking about it and throwing out specs. They did not show off a ton of footage from games running on Scorpio that could be easily compared with the other Xbox One titles they just showed. Yes, the Scorpio is a larger leap in power, but it may end up running into the same perception problems we’ve seen with the Pro regardless. Microsoft played this smart, and so far, has avoided the situation Sony now finds themselves in.

Sony couldn’t have really have gone down that path either, however, because simply listing specs with no footage would have allowed Microsoft to easily claim the power narrative by simply…having better specs. So they didn’t do anything at all.

While I think not showing the PS4 Pro at E3 was the right move, I still am unsure that the very existence of the console is a good idea. I think Sony is going to have an absolute hell of a time convincing players without a 4K TV to buy one, and given that includes roughly 85% of the market, the PS4 Pro seems like a pretty niche luxury purchase. It’s been a few days and I’m still trying to wrap my head around the target audience for the product. Players who have abstained from next-gen until now and don’t care about saving $100 on a Slim? Players who own 4K TVs and have enough money where they don’t mind spending another $400 on a console to replace the perfectly functional one they already have? There don’t seem to be many good options here. I’m not sure Microsoft will fare much better here, even with more power, but we’ll have to wait and see. And we might be waiting a while, given Scorpio’s year-away release. As for how PS4 Pro will perform this Christmas, that’s anyone’s guess, but Sony wants consumers to commit to their new console before NX and Scorpio arrive next year, and if nothing else, they have a big head start.

By next holiday season, Microsoft may have a compelling VR companion on the power level of Vive/Rift or even a slight step above those in specs to go along with the Scorpio with some serious gaming capability while Sony is stuck with their PSVR that really is too low res to be more than a "toy".

Things go both ways. Playstation Network fed off of Xbox Live's amazing early success and risks Microsoft took when half of their console users still had dial up. Sony will make the leap this time with their PSVR but it will most likely be Xbox with a powerful enough console and way better VR spec solution that takes advantage of that next year. No way Sony can drop support for their under powered PSVR in just one year so besides the Scorpio being much more powerful than the PS4 Pro, their VR solution most likely will be as well. Those that find they like the higher end VR experience (that will be just about everyone) will be able to probably use the same Scorpio compatible VR headset with their high end PC, and also not have to buy the same games again as one purchase gets you both Xbox and PC versions now. Seems like a win solution since you can also use IMO, the better controller for gaming (as well as the Elite version) on both Xbox/PC. Sony is late to the game with their streaming to PC solution.

Hell, after having the ugliest console in history with the Xbox One, the Xbox One s actually looks better than the triple decker PS4 Pro:



That's quite a turnaround.

If Sony does anything to upgrade and release yet another console before holiday 2018, I see a bunch of pissed off PS4 "Pro" users that got stuck with a half-assed upgrade that really has no place considering the leap in power between Xbox One/PS4 and Scorpio.

[Aslanna]

From Forbes.com:

One of the great mysteries of E3 this year was Sony’s refusal to show off the console everyone knew existed, PS4 Neo, during the biggest games show of the year. Ahead of their press event, Sony downplayed the new system, saying it wouldn’t be shown until later. During the event, Sony put on a great show, but ended on a very clear anti-climax, showing off footage from Days Gone, a new zombie game that had already debuted earlier in the night, as their big finale. It seemed like a clear-cut case of the Neo being ripped out of that final slot, and shelved for another day.

Considering Sony said BEFORE E3 that it wouldn't be there... Yeah a clear case of it being ripped out. The author of that article is a moron. He even stated it a sentence before so how he arrived at the illogical leap that it was supposed to be there is beyond me. Given the time when Sony stated that (10-Jun) and when the actual event happened (13-Jun) if it was something that was taken out they could have moved things around to not end where they ended.

Popular rumor seems to be there WAS supposed to be something else there at the end but most people believe it was going to be Red Dead Redemption 2 but due to the Orlando event that was pulled at the last minute. While just a rumor it makes more sense than the Neo being shown since they already said it wouldn't be.

[Winnow]

Pretty clear it was supposed to be at the end. Even with the focus diverting Orchestra, Sony's ending to the E3 Event was really suspect with that hella long demo of a game already shown earlier in the presentation. Of course they said it wasn't going to be shown before E3 began, they knew about Scorpio by then.

A few more things:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/20 ... 116c874d38

Ad blocked so here's the content is you can't read it directly:

It’s only September, but the holiday season is already fast-approaching. This means we have a bunch of big purchases in our near future, whether those are gifts to loved ones or Black Friday deals.

For video games and the people who love to play them, 2016′s holiday season is the first since 2013 in which brand new video game consoles are being sold. Granted, these aren’t brand new in the same way the PS4 and Xbox One were brand new three years ago, but they do represent significant refreshes to both Sony and Microsoft’s gaming systems.

In an effort to help conflicted shoppers in the coming months, here are six reasons why it makes more sense to buy an Xbox One S instead of the PS4 Pro this holiday season.

Which console should you buy this holiday season? (Credit: Erik Kain/Sony/Microsoft)

1. Ultra-HD Blu-Ray

Both the Xbox One S and the PS4 Pro are taking advantage of 4K resolution and HDR (high-dynamic range) technology. But while the PS4 Pro boasts a more powerful processor and graphics chip, the Xbox One S is the only console available with a built-in Ultra-HD Blu-Ray player. This is important.

First, let’s get some definitions out of the way.

Most HD television sets right now boast a 1080p resolution. That’s “HD” and that’s also the resolution that a standard Blu-Ray disc plays at.

But now we have a new generation of TV technology called Ultra-HD. This displays at 4K resolution—essentially four times the pixel count of 1080p. It’s much more high-fidelity, and is mostly noticeable on bigger screens.

The only way to properly take advantage of this resolution is with Ultra-HD media. Ultra-HD Blu-Ray plays at 4K, basically four times that of regular Blu-Ray. While some websites like Netflix and YouTube and Amazon Prime all have 4K streaming options, streaming is always limited by internet speeds and compression.

This means that to truly take advantage of 4K media, the Xbox One S is your best option this holiday season, since it’s the only gaming system that has an Ultra-HD Blu-Ray player. If you get a PS4 Pro and still want that feature, you’ll also need to buy an Ultra-HD Blu-Ray player, which cost around $300 at the moment.

2. The Xbox One S is cheaper.

With all the above in mind, it’s important that we talk price. The PS4 Pro costs $399, which isn’t a bad price at all considering it’s a very powerful system.

However, the Xbox One S is just $299. That hundred dollars could go toward a new game and a second controller.

Now consider how much it would cost to get a PS4 Pro and an Ultra-HD Blu-Ray player. $300 + $399 = $699. That’s a healthy chunk of change on top of a potential TV upgrade (considering you’ll need an Ultra-HD TV with HDR to take advantage of either of these consoles.)

To be fair, the PS4 Pro is a more powerful console. If price isn’t an issue, then the PS4 Pro has the horsepower advantage. But the Xbox One S is absolutely the budget-friendly winner in this fight.

3. The Xbox One S is bundled with five games.

There are various Xbox One S bundles you can buy this holiday season, but by far the best deal out the gates is the standard Xbox One S that, for $299, is also bundled with Halo 5 and the Halo Master Chief Collection.

That collection includes four games: Halo: Combat Evolved Anniversary, Halo 2, Halo 3, and Halo 4.

That’s five Halo games and a brand new console for $299, one of the best bundle deals I’ve seen pretty much ever. Of course, if you already have all those Halo games, one of the other bundles might make more sense.

4. The Xbox One S will have mod support for games like Skyrim Remastered.

One of the exciting things about this generation of consoles, is just how similar the Xbox One and PS4 are to gaming computers. Sure, they’re not as powerful as the beefiest gaming PC, but they were closer, and they were going to offer us new features like mod support.

Leading that charge was publisher and developer Bethesda, the maker of The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim and Fallout 4. These are games that have a ton of support for user-generated content (mods) on PC. Soon, that feature was supposed to roll out on PS4.

Now we’ve learned that Sony is unwilling to let Bethesda support mods the way that company says they need for mods to happen on the PS4. What this means, at least for the time being, is that mods will only be available on PC and Xbox One.

5. Backwards compatibility

If you’re upgrading from a last-gen console, your library of games may be an important determining factor in which new console to buy.

Unfortunately, the PlayStation 4 is not backwards compatible with PlayStation 3 games. Sony does offer a great subscription service—PlayStation Now—that lets you play PS3 and PS2 games on your PS4 (as well as other devices like your PC) and there’s also a number of top-notch remasters available on PlayStation 4. However, you can’t simply pop a PS3 disc into your PS4 and play it.

Not all Xbox 360 games are backwards compatible on Xbox One either, but a large and growing list are. This isn’t an important feature to everybody, but it is nice to be able to trade in your old system, but still keep some of your favorite games.

6. Xbox Live is still better than PSN

I was hoping that in 2016 I could happily report that Xbox Live and the PlayStation Network were both equally safe and secure and free from long stretches of downtime. Sadly, the fact remains that the PSN goes down more often than its Xbox counterpart. We report on PSN outages far more often than Xbox Live outages, and that’s still true in 2016.

And now that Xbox also offers Games with Gold, the free monthly games advantage that came with subscribing to PS+ has evaporated. The only remaining advantage to PlayStation’s network is the fact that you don’t need to pay for a subscription to use each and every online service, such as game demos and betas.

Still, at the end of the day if security and reliability are a concern, Xbox Live is the way to go, adding just one more reason to buy an Xbox One S over a PS4 Pro this holiday season.
Bonus: Xbox One exclusives are now ‘Play Anywhere’

One final benefit to purchasing an Xbox One S over a PS4 Pro? Going forward, Microsoft has adopted a “Play Anywhere” philosophy for its exclusive content. This means that when you buy a game like Gears of War 4, you’ll get a copy for your Xbox and a copy for your PC (so long as you’re running Windows 10.) This means you can play on either your console or your computer. That may not be super important to everyone, but it’s a nice feature. Any time you can get two for the price of one, it can’t hurt.
In Conclusion

Ultimately, there are reasons to buy both these consoles. There are factors that I didn’t touch on in the above six reasons that should guide your purchasing decision. These include the games you want to play.

Each system has its own exclusives, from Uncharted and God of War on PlayStation, to Halo and Gears of War on Xbox. You should absolutely consider which console has the exclusive content you prefer before buying.

Another big factor in determining which console to buy is which one your friends play on. If all your friends are playing on PlayStation 4, buying an Xbox One S might leave you out in the cold (or vice versa.)

And there are reasons to buy a PS4 Pro over an Xbox One S which I’ll touch on later. For now, hopefully these reasons help you at least think more carefully about which console you should buy going into the holidays this year.

Finally, the prices listed here are as of this writing. There will be deals on both systems and certainly on older versions of both the Xbox One and PlayStation 4 as we trudge toward Christmas. We’ll try to keep readers appraised of any good deals we come across.
The Xbox One S has already launched. The PS4 Pro comes out November 10th.
P.S.

Oh, and one final note: Microsoft is releasing its own “Pro” console in 2017, codenamed the Xbox One “Scorpio.” This is much more powerful than the Xbox One S, and spec-wise, even more powerful than the PS4 Pro. We don’t know much about it yet, but if you’re a patient consumer, waiting until the Scorpio lands might be a smart move. Whether it truly outperforms the PS4 Pro, and what it’s price-tag will be, remain to be seen

Before someone gets all uppity about Live being better:

Xbox Live Faster and More Reliable Than PlayStation Network, Says Report

In terms of reliability, Xbox Live had a better score for login time to network, login time to game servers, and uninterrupted play, while there is no noticeable difference when it comes to matchmaking.

In terms of speed, Xbox Live is speedier at logging in to both the network and game server, and has a faster time to upload. Once again, there's no noticeable difference between PSN and Xbox Live when it comes to speed of matchmaking.

"The Overall Quality experience combined both Speed and Reliability metrics while also including other indicators of game quality, such as the ability to join gameplay with friends and share achievements, as well as the quality of sound for voice chat," says the report.

"Xbox Live produced higher scores in Overall Quality than PlayStation Network in three out of four metrics," it continues. Xbox Live comes out on top on logging into the game server, joining a party, and voice chat quality.

Xbox One was August's top selling console.

Also kind of funny, considering Sony's mocking of Xbox One's sharing system where they handed a hard copy of a game to a friend so they could play it. Where's the mocking when it comes to backward compatibility? You can pop a 360 game in your console or give to a friend, not so much with the PS4. Since digital download barely existed last gen, hard copies actually matter for that. hmmm.

Sony is isolating itself.

1. It's backtracking on mod support and there's yet another article I won't post where Bethesda blames Sony for the lack of mod support.

2. Sony is responsible for lack of matchmaking between PS4/Xbox/PC. Everyone else is ready and developers say they only need to "flip a switch" yet Sony won't.

3. Xbox/PC - one price for both platforms. If you own a decent PC you get to take advantage of way better graphics. PS4, yet again isolated or "stream". Another small point to consider is if you are a PC gamer and decide to go console in the future, some of your PC games will work on Xbox, not so on PS4 unless you buy them again.

When considering the three points above, "Walled garden" comes to mind. Point 4 can easily become VR being usable between Scorpio/PC where VR absolutely requires the most powerful system you can muster while PSVR, with lower VR specs to begin with will be stuck on lower Spec'd PS4 "Pro".



If someone was coming into this generation new from a past generation, I see lots of reasons to go Xbox and not many for PS4. Start with Xbox One s this year with 4K/HDR/Blu Ray 4K, great Online and versatile to PC for more power for $100 less than semi upgrade PS4 "Pro", and then Scorpio next year with a significant leap in power and higher quality VR, still maintaining ability to use all those games you had on Xbox One S on PC if you decide not to upgrade consoles at all.

[Aslanna]

It wasn't clear at all. Except to idiots. Not even going to bother reading the rest of your wall of text. I'm pretty much done with this topic.

[Winnow]

I'm not! You can ignore the rest of the post above, I would too if I was a Sony fanboi. Blinders!

Here's the thing about 4K Blu-Ray.

If you buy a film on Blu-ray or 4K Blu-ray you're getting superior picture quality and sound compared to streaming or download. Buy a game on disc and you're getting exactly the same as the download. That's why I get my movies on disc and games on download

Maybe Joe Sixpack is content to get his movies from Netflix Streaming, but then Joe Sixpack is buying a PS4 Slim.

4K streaming has got to be shit (don't know personally yet) because 1080 streaming already is shit compared to standard Blu-Ray.

I downloaded a 22GB 1080P version of Avatar awhile back. The quality blows the ever loving shit out of Streaming 1080 HD on Netflix or other streaming services. It's not a case where you're squinting to see the difference. It's flat out leagues better quality.

Now that's 1080P and 22 GB is actually not even the highest quality I could have downloaded. Moving to 4K you're looking at 100 GB for a movie. No chance in hell you're streaming that each time you stream a 4K movie on Netflix or anywhere else.

I'd upload the movie so you could see the difference but guess why I won't? Because it's too fucking big of a file.

So, while, as always, something missing from a Playstation console NEVER seems to matter to people on this forum, Microsoft including a 4K Blu-Ray in their standard $299 console is a very notable perk. That Sony is trying to justify not including their own pimped Blu-Ray format in 4K even on their "Pro" console because of streaming is comical. Even Microsoft can afford it in their cheap console while paying license fees to Sony most likely.

I assume I'll get the Wii argument here. "Oh it's good enough". Yeah. OK. That's like saying flying coach class is fine when business class is way more comfortable but in the case of 4K Blu-Ray, it's not that you can't afford it, it's because Sony didn't include it and the cheapest stand alone 4K Blu-Ray (waste space on another piece of equipment) is $300.

Some clear bad decisions and questionable hardware designs from Sony lately which are detailed in what you chose to wear blinders for.