Druid CH on Test *NO SHIT*

brenen · Post by **brenen** » August 22, 2002, 2:15 pm

I dont really disagree with this change at all.. More healing on raids is always greatlly appreciated.

Lets look at the standard raid group of 42 or 7 groups.. Remember we are Pre Vindi, but post Trakanon, so my experience may differ from yours.

Important

Warrior(MT)
Warrior(ST/Add tank)
Warrior(Oh Shit/Add Tank)
3
Cleric(cleric for every group, 1 or 2 more would be optimal)
Cleric
Cleric
Cleric
Cleric
Cleric
Cleric
7
Mage (coh, mods)
1
Monk(puller)
Monk(splitin Hard stuff/pets)
Monk(splitin Hard stuff/pets)
3
Wizard(translocates)
1
Necro(ghetto coh, or if DMF needed (exclude mana dump imo))
1
Enc(KEI/Haste/Tashicide)
Enc(aggro control, cc, sieve)
2
Pali(not required but gheto buffs nice, Group heal good on AE type mobs)
1
Ranger(not required but gheto buffs nice, High DPS)
1
Druid(if circles needed, also POTC)
1
Shaman(Melee Bufferage, Malo/slow)
1
Shadow Knight(Harm Touch, when not resisted.. is a nice finisher)
1

Then add high DPS people as needed.. IE Rogues, Wizards, Monks, Rangers.

Out of the 23 people I would considered required to raid something large for us.. 30% are clerics. Now Druids/shamans Might be able to fill in for some of the last few groups clerics, but I would usually prefer a cleric.

Obviously something is wrong with that. However, we as clerics just want something so we dont get totally replaced in xps group. I myself rarely have trouble getting a group, and almost always group with guildies or AE.
But, I know some clerics that dont have a large of support system, or as long a time in the game, that can never seem to find a group.

Voronwë · Post by **Voronwë** » August 22, 2002, 2:40 pm

Call of the Predator is not a ghetto buff.

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 22, 2002, 2:52 pm

Brenen, that group is easily Vindi-capable. With those clerics, you could keep anyone up long enough to tank him.

Aslanna · Post by **Aslanna** » August 22, 2002, 2:53 pm

CoP blinky!

Aabidano · Post by **Aabidano** » August 22, 2002, 2:55 pm

Fairweather Pure wrote:Instead of bitching

Good one. Sheer volume of bitching and whining is what got this implemented. VI knows where their bread is buttered.

Name another class that has the mix of abilities druids already have. Damn, there aren't any. Imagine that.

Druids aren't broken, there are just way too many of them. Many of them being clueless as they spent 55 levels soloing and now think they need automatic inclusion into every group. Look how many 55+ druids are around compared to any other class. Wonder how/why that happened. Gee, they all have better armor than they can get in ToV, cry me a river.

I don't have a problem with them getting improved healing, but the whineing makes me want to spew.

Not aiming at you in particular, but on the whole they are the biggest bunch of freaking crybabies I've ever seen.

There's been a running discussion on the enchanter board forever on what could be done to "fix" us on raids. Unfortunately nearly everything that could be done will either step on another classes toes, or overpower us in normal exp type situations. I'm pretty happy with my class regardless.

Hammerstalker PE · Post by **Hammerstalker PE** » August 22, 2002, 3:00 pm

Wizards for TL's LOL I would think they would be more important for MANABURN and Giants/Dragonsbane Nukes than any TL's.

*~*stragi*~* · Post by ***~*stragi*~*** » August 22, 2002, 3:12 pm

Sabek wrote:5 new spells on test for clerics.
Ethereal Elixir group 1200 heal over 24 sec for 975 mana
http://lucy.fnord.net/spell.html?id=2180&source=Test

Ethereal Light DL upgrade 1600 heal for 525 in 5 seconds.
http://lucy.fnord.net/spell.html?id=2182&source=Test

Ethereal Remedy 975 heal for 400 mana in 2.75 seconds.
http://lucy.fnord.net/spell.html?id=2462&source=Test

Yaulp 5 with haste and 10/tick mana regen

New summoned hammer that they think will have a focus effect.

thats the other stuff i forgot about

Nadonius · Post by **Nadonius** » August 22, 2002, 6:34 pm

Just remember that this is only on test, and may not go live at all.
I for one am sick of being outhealed by hybrids. A 58 Pally heals more with a group spell than a Druid can do with his best single target heal untill 60. Even a Ranger can match the direct healing power of a Druid untill 60. Look at the current healing power

Level 55: Cloroblast Heals 400 damage in 3 seconds for 175 mana.
This isn't even enough to heal casters well. Fast casting and really only effective if you constantly spam heal.

Level 60: Natures Touch Heals 900 damage for 400 mana in 5 seconds.
Basically like divine light, its enough to make a noticeable heal on a tank, depending on buffs.

Level 60: Natures Recovery heal over time 30hps a tick for 3 minutes. 250mana and 1.5 minute recycle time.
Good for healing shammie cann damage, usefull in a small group/partner situation.

Take these spells into a raid situation with ae damage. All im really needed for is to cast circles and cabbage on a few casters. The way I see it Druids should be second to Clerics on healing utility. As it stands now we are third behind Paladins.

The way I would like to see this done is to add a group heal, on par or slightly better than a Paladin's, at level 56 or so, and add a heal over time similar to celestial healing. I dont think this would be over powering or infringe too much on a clerics heals, just enough to keep my group alive so the clerics can focus on keeping up the MT.

I suspect all theyre trying to test is what impact there would be if they upped our healing power.
Keep in mind, IF this goes live, this heal will probably be a huge mana sink with a long recycle time.

Jugata · Post by **Jugata** » August 22, 2002, 6:34 pm

The only thing I've ever wanted from VI was invis. That's the end of my speech.

Teurde

Canelek · Post by **Canelek** » August 22, 2002, 6:40 pm

The only thing I've ever wanted from VI was invis.

A useful spell? Nah. You will probably end up with a series of buffs for other people's pets. God forbid VI would do something that is a good idea. *shrug*

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 22, 2002, 6:49 pm

Can't you buy invis potions in the bazaar? I mean, I know it isn't as good as a spell, but at least it's an option until VI gives you something else.
My alts have to buy SoW potions. /shrug

Rainus · Post by **Rainus** » August 22, 2002, 11:57 pm

'Good one. Sheer volume of bitching and whining is what got this implemented. VI knows where their bread is buttered. '

So what has this got to do with anything ? if you want YOUR classes improve .. go back to VI and not bash another class coz they did their work

'Name another class that has the mix of abilities druids already have. Damn, there aren't any. Imagine that.'

What Useful abilities ? list them

'Druids aren't broken, there are just way too many of them. Many of them being clueless as they spent 55 levels soloing and now think they need automatic inclusion into every group. Look how many 55+ druids are around compared to any other class. Wonder how/why that happened. Gee, they all have better armor than they can get in ToV, cry me a river.'

Ever occur to you that so many of these druids running around are port bots ?
Sorry we don't want or need automatic inclusion into every group .. we just want a fair and equal consideration .. same as any other classes deserved
Better armor than they can get in ToV ? hmm care to name some of them ?
I have been 60 a bloody long time .. and no I don't run around with better armor than ToV ... and so what the hell is the point of this statement ?

'I don't have a problem with them getting improved healing, but the whineing makes me want to spew.'

Ditto and amen to YOUR whining too

'Not aiming at you in particular, but on the whole they are the biggest bunch of freaking crybabies I've ever seen. '

haha

'There's been a running discussion on the enchanter board forever on what could be done to "fix" us on raids. Unfortunately nearly everything that could be done will either step on another classes toes, or overpower us in normal exp type situations. I'm pretty happy with my class regardless.'

I'm not going to comment on chanters .. BECAUSE I don't play an enchanter and don't see from an enchanter's point of view

Joramile · Post by **Joramile** » August 23, 2002, 4:57 am

This is ONE LONG THREAD so I didn't read the whole thing nor do I know if this was already mentioned.

All the pre-50 healing spells (Light Healing, Healing, Greater Healing) all come at the same level between druids and shamans.

Now if they give a druid a fat ass CH then I hope they at least upgrade Torpor for shamans.

but nonetheless druids will have more of a role in raids I guess that does make it easier for some stuff...

Jugata · Post by **Jugata** » August 23, 2002, 8:18 am

I don't buy sow potions, I click jboots.

I don't buy invis potions, I train to zone.

I buy peridots. Lots and lots of peridots.

Animalor · Post by **Animalor** » August 23, 2002, 8:44 am

Heh.

Beastlords didn't even make that list =/

Joramile · Post by **Joramile** » August 23, 2002, 8:52 am

one thing I wanna mention (which is usually disreguarded now) is the Roleplaying factor of the game.

Warriors are brave fighters who don't try to fake their own death.

Wizards are fierce sorcerers who can fry you're ass in one shot.

What i'm leading to is that Clerics are NOW bitching about their grouping etc. Okay well see in a roleplaying sense a cleric heals, a druid humps trees, etc etc. They all do their job! If they wanted to make the game more true to much of the written Lore...Wizards wouldn't have stuff like their self HP buffs, Warriors would have less armor and more dmg output, Paladin/SK would have more hp/ac but less dmg output than warrior, a druid would infuse himself with nature to do healing stuff and bring the wrath of Nature upon its victims.

See EQ is kinda a bad example if this is your first fantasy type game.

All in all STFU play the game switch classes if you want and create hell for the game...see if I care

Elf · Post by **Elf** » August 23, 2002, 9:46 am

Id be happy with the change, will help my guild out as a whole since we have a limited supply of clerics.

Aarinu · Post by **Aarinu** » August 23, 2002, 12:42 pm

Drasta · Post by **Drasta** » August 23, 2002, 2:30 pm

blah just give clerics a class skill that makes them no longer require dots and crap to cast spells and that should make them happy

brenen · Post by **brenen** » August 23, 2002, 2:47 pm

Wizards for TL's LOL I would think they would be more important for MANABURN and Giants/Dragonsbane Nukes than any TL's.

I said Required.. Your thinking like an Uber guild. I dont blame you much though, it took me a good 3 months after I left CoE to lower my perspective to a guild our size and level.

The problem with all the abilities you mention is it requires the wizard to be 60. Belive it or not, not everyone is 60 yet

As I said Add Rogues, Wizards, Monks, Rangers for DPS as avaiable. Its nearish the bottom of my post.. Besides with 40 people in the belly of some dungeon, getting everyone in and out quickly is pretty high on my concern list.

My point was that many clerics needed for a raid compared to others is absurd.

Hammerstalker PE · Post by **Hammerstalker PE** » August 23, 2002, 3:38 pm

My apologies Brenan

I missed two points you were making.

One is that you now lead a lower level (as in players levels) Guild

and two the line near the end of your post regarding DPS.

Fairweather Pure · Post by **Fairweather Pure** » August 23, 2002, 4:51 pm

The pont is Brenen, that of all those that you listed, only clerics are required in high numbers. A single wizard can TL everyone from a raid. Druids can TL 5 others, and all spell casters can gate. Hell, melees are required to have Thurg gate potions just in case.

All that DPS you mentioned is nice, but it can me accomplished with any mix of various classes, as you yourself mentioned. Clerics are the absolute only class that requires unusually large numbers to raid with. Hell, if you have good aggro, only one warrior is needed, although secondaries are always nice "just in case".

zotha · Post by **zotha** » August 24, 2002, 12:48 pm

Rofl, you had to mention group CH because a 2 item list wasn't sufficient huh? You realize this is just about the worst spell we have. I haven't bought it, never plan to, never will. I can think of so many better ways to spend the what.. 900 or more mana?

Thats probably the most ignorant comment ive seen from a cleric this week.

VeeshanVault

Druid CH on Test NO SHIT

Its only a test...

Im happy