Bad knees!

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Lalanae
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Bad knees!

Post by Lalanae »

A year or so back when I tried to get into a running program, I realized I have bad knees. It's mainly the left one, but the right one can get cranky too.

As far as cardio, I stick to an eliptical machine and am usually OK. Running is out and even fast walking can get me into trouble, so I generally only use the treadmill for cool downs.

My fear is with strength training because I'm afraid of fucking up my knee, but I know that strengthening the muscles around the knee can help prevent injury. I hired a personal trainer for a few months and even under his watch, squats and lunges made my knees ache after a couple weeks...and he had me do millions of those it seems. He was pretty sucky because he didnt seem to think my knee pains were occuring because of the workout and didnt seem to want to change anything. (He was generally shitty in other areas too, so I dropped him)

So, I'm back to working out on my own (and doing a lot better, I might add). I need some advice about what to stay away from and what to focus on to help my knees. I have generally bad form in anything I do it seems (lol) so I stay away from free weights and stick with machines.

I fucking hate squats and lunges (the worst), so god help me if that's the answer to all this.
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Tyek
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

I am going to have my 7th knee surgery tomorrow(so you will be spared my babble for about 4 days while I recover at the hospital), second on my left leg and 5 on my right. I hate to tell you the trainer is right, but for the most part he/she is. The stronger the muscles in your legs are the less pressure your knees will feel.

My physical therapy involves squats, squats, core stregthening and more squats. He makes me wear a belt with rubber bands from the waist to the ankle and do squats on an unbalanced board (which is brutal) and do squats with weights as well as basic squats. Lots of leg curls as well.

The elliptical actually still hurt my knees, so I ride the excercise bike anywhere from 22 to 25 miles every other day. If you do ride a bike, I suggest a standard upright exercise bike. The recumbant bikes do not make your leg muscles work as hard.

As for the pain, that may sadly just be arthritis, if it is, you will be worse off if you stop excercising. Studies show that regular exercising reduces arthritis flare ups and every 10 lbs you reduce from your frame takes off significant pressure on your knees. Check into orthotics as well, they can help sometimes.

If you are getting worse, you can have your doctor check your leg alignment. I am having my second Osteotomy tomorrow, as well as a second microfracture. If your legs are more then 5% out of alignment, the osteotomy can improve the weight dispersment on the affected part of your knee.

Anyway, if you want to know more IM me. I would be happy to tell you other options, I have tried all but replacement which I am too young for. I will give you my home number if you want to talk some more about it. I feel like I am becoming an expert on this crap.
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Aardor »

I know next to nothing about this subject, but I just wanted to say good luck on your surgery Tyek. My mother is going to have to go through her second surgery sometime soon, and after helping her out following the first one, knee surgery is something I never want to go through.
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Tyek
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

Thanks, this is what they are doing this time. Last time I had the osteotomy and a complete cartilage replant, using my own cartilage, which they regrew and replanted in my knee.

Knee osteotomy is commonly used to realign your knee structure if you have arthritic damage on only one side of your knee. The goal is to shift your body weight off the damaged area to the other side of your knee, where the cartilage is still healthy. When surgeons remove a wedge of your shinbone from underneath the healthy side of your knee, the shinbone and thighbone can bend away from the damaged cartilage.

Imagine the hinges on a door. When the door is shut, the hinges are flush against the wall. As the door swings open, one side of the door remains pressed against the wall as space opens up on the other side. Removing just a small wedge of bone can "swing" your knee open, pressing the healthy tissue together as space opens up between the thighbone and shinbone on the damaged side so that the arthritic surfaces do not rub against each other.

Osteotomy is also used as an alternative treatment to total knee replacement in younger and active patients. Because prosthetic knees may wear out over time, an osteotomy procedure can enable younger, active osteoarthritis patients to continue using the healthy portion of their knee. The procedure can delay the need for a total knee replacement for up to ten years.
Microfracture surgery is an orthopedic surgical technique that can help restore knee cartilage by creating tiny fractures in the adjacent bones, causing new cartilage to develop. It can be used to treat both degenerative knee problems as well as cartilage injuries, and has gained a high profile in the sports world in recent years; numerous professional athletes including members of the NBA, NFL and NHL (most notably Greg Oden and Amare Stoudemire) have undergone the procedure.

The surgery is quick (taking around 30 minutes), minimally invasive, and has significantly shorter recovery times than an arthroplasty (knee replacement). Combined with a high rate of success, these factors have caused orthopedic surgeons to use the procedure with increasing frequency.


The funny part is, they say with having 2 of these I may grow up to 1/4", which would finally officially put me over 6'1".
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Lalanae »

My knees only act up when I've been working out regularly. When I've gone through a phase of not working out my knees give me no problems. I would think if it was arthritis it would be an issue regardless of how active I was.

I'm not really in a position to see a doctor about this right now (no health insurance), but I wouldn't be suprised if it was a alignment issue. I know I had/have some alignment issues with my back and hips that a chiropractor was working on years ago, so maybe its related somehow.

I just know that the more squats and lunges I do, the more my knees ache. Would leg presses work instead maybe? I can control my form better seated than standing.
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

Do they have a total gym at your gym? You could use that. The total gym allows you to choose the degree of angle you would squat at. As you get stronger you can increase your angle, some even have spots for weights as you continue to work out.

As for the knee issue. If it was arthritis inactivity would hurt. You should see me after a 2 hours drive, I literally cannot bend my right knee for about 4 minutes. You could have a patellar misalignment. That would cause you issues the more you used it, or you could have some damaged cartilage that inflames when you do some heavier lifting. Frankly I would skip any weight bearing cardio for the time being and move to an excercise bike and a "total gym' (The Chuck Norris/Christie brinkley thing). See if you can build up some muscle and see if it really the weight bearing that is causing the issues.

Does it hurt if you walk around for a long time or was it only after running. Some knees are just not built for pounding on hard surfaces (even a treadmill).
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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Lalanae
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Lalanae »

Tyek wrote:Do they have a total gym at your gym? You could use that. The total gym allows you to choose the degree of angle you would squat at. As you get stronger you can increase your angle, some even have spots for weights as you continue to work out.

As for the knee issue. If it was arthritis inactivity would hurt. You should see me after a 2 hours drive, I literally cannot bend my right knee for about 4 minutes. You could have a patellar misalignment. That would cause you issues the more you used it, or you could have some damaged cartilage that inflames when you do some heavier lifting. Frankly I would skip any weight bearing cardio for the time being and move to an excercise bike and a "total gym' (The Chuck Norris/Christie brinkley thing). See if you can build up some muscle and see if it really the weight bearing that is causing the issues.

Does it hurt if you walk around for a long time or was it only after running. Some knees are just not built for pounding on hard surfaces (even a treadmill).
I don't think my gym has one.

You know, when I watch a movie in the theater, especially if its a long one, my knees start hurting. So maybe it is arthritis.

As far as walking, if its a slow pace, no problems. A brisk pace will cause knee pain after awhile. The faster I walk/run the quicker the pain comes on.

I generally don't like stationary bikes (I have to be conscious of my posture since I slouch when I sit and my butt doesn't like those seats :P), but I'll start substituting 1 or 2 of my eliptical cardio workout a week with a bike and see if that helps. I should be mixing up my cardio anyway.
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

Good luck and when you get insurance go see a doctor.
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Drolgin Steingrinder »

Best cure for bad joints that I know of (and I know of bad joints, both ankles, left knee, right shoulder) is swimming. I've never managed to fuck up any joint swimming, and it's excellent exercise.

The worst part for me as far as joints go is that I'm pretty much unable to participate in any of the sports I enjoy for fear of fucking things up further; no football (soccer for you colonials), no badminton, basketball or squash. It sucks.
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

I am off to the hospital, make sure you guys have some interesting things for me to read when I get back in 2-4 days!!!

Yes, Drolgin is right, swimming is good, anything that eliminates weight bearing.
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Lalanae »

Good luck Tyek and thanks for the advice!
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

I'm home. I feel like shit, but I am home!

The cartilage damage was too extensive to fix with Microfrature, so they just did the osteotomy.
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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Re: Bad knees!

Post by Tyek »

Just got home from my 9th knee surgery. The good news, they were able to remove the plate they had put in my leg last year when they reangled it and the bone appears to have healed well.

The bad news, my left knee is almost bone on bone now as well. He scoped it during the surgery and I knew it was getting worse, but he confirmed it.

The doctor says the osteotomy should slow down the damage significantly and he hopes that he will not have to see me for many years!! So I am going to recover this week, rehab the knee and try and get healthy enough to make my business trip to Phoenix next week. We have a box seat for the Coyotes game and I want to go.
When I was younger, I used to think that the world was doing it to me and that the world owes me some thing…When you're a teeny bopper, that's what you think. I'm 40 now, I don't think that anymore, because I found out it doesn't f--king work. One has to go through that. For the people who even bother to go through that, most assholes just accept what it is anyway and get on with it." - John Lennon
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